Ultimate limit - Revision history

Apm: /* Wishful thinking vs Exploratory engineering */ some improvements

2023-06-20T11:28:25Z

Wishful thinking vs Exploratory engineering: some improvements

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:28, 20 June 2023
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	== Wishful thinking vs Exploratory engineering ==		== Wishful thinking vs Exploratory engineering ==

	~~The point is: <br>~~
	Speculating about things that would be '''VERY''' surprising if discovered when <br>		Speculating about things that would be '''VERY''' surprising if discovered when <br>
	there is still absolutely no clue yet where to even start looking is a pointless and unproductive activity. <br>		there is still absolutely no clue yet where to even start looking is a pointless and unproductive activity. <br>
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	This "everything is eventually possible" [[wishful thinking]] mindset <br>		This "everything is eventually possible" [[wishful thinking]] mindset <br>
	is in stark polar contrast to stringent [[exploratory engineering]] methodology. <br>		is in stark polar contrast to stringent usage of [[exploratory engineering]] (EE) methodology. <br>
	~~There~~ one picks only problems where there are aspects that are exceptionally well amenable <br>
	to analysis via well established formal methods and models. ~~And as~~ a product one gains:		In EE one picks only problems where there are aspects that are exceptionally well amenable <br>
			to analysis via well established formal methods and models and one applies large safety margins to the results. <br>
			As a product one gains:
	* highly attractive far term development targets (like advanced [[gemstone metamaterial on-chip factories]])		* highly attractive far term development targets (like advanced [[gemstone metamaterial on-chip factories]])
	* many construction-site open-ends where work is identified to be needed to eventually reach the identified target. See: [[bridging the gaps]]		* many construction-site open-ends where work is identified to be needed to eventually reach the identified target. See: [[bridging the gaps]]

Apm: /* No! Nothing is absolutely impossible. Everyone wo says so is wrong. */ some reformulations and changes

2023-06-20T11:25:21Z

No! Nothing is absolutely impossible. Everyone wo says so is wrong.: some reformulations and changes

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:25, 20 June 2023
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	Nature can cross that density range only transiently in a non stable way during stellar collapses.		Nature can cross that density range only transiently in a non stable way during stellar collapses.

	= No! Nothing is absolutely impossible. Everyone wo says so is wrong. =		= No! Nothing is absolutely impossible. Everyone who says so is wrong. =

	~~In this regard there seems to exist an almost religious group mindset in society.~~

			'''See main page: [[Impossible]]''' <br>
			In this regard there seems to exist an almost religious group mindset in society. <br>
	Yes, indeed, nothing is ever impossible with absolute certainty. '''BUT ...''' <br>		Yes, indeed, nothing is ever impossible with absolute certainty. '''BUT ...''' <br>
	Many things (lets call them X) are:		Many things (lets call them X) are:
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	* Unknowable errors regarding X made in (1) (that is: errors that make X unexpectedly much more likely than expected) fall into (2).		* Unknowable errors regarding X made in (1) (that is: errors that make X unexpectedly much more likely than expected) fall into (2).

	== ~~Whisful~~ thinking vs Exploratory engineering ==		== Wishful thinking vs Exploratory engineering ==

	The point is: <br>		The point is: <br>
	Speculating about ~~these way different~~ things that would be ~~very~~ surprising if discovered ~~(but no discovery, no matter how surprising, can ever be excluded with absolute certainty)~~ when there is still absolutely no clue yet where to even start looking is a ~~very~~ pointless and unproductive activity ~~(except~~ it's done ~~for~~ jelly soft SciFi entertainment purposes).		Speculating about things that would be '''VERY''' surprising if discovered when <br>
			there is still absolutely no clue yet where to even start looking is a pointless and unproductive activity. <br>
			Except maybe if it's done in the context of jelly-soft SciFi for entertainment purposes only.

			Well, yes, no discovery, no matter how surprising, can ever be excluded with absolute certainty. <br>
			(see page: [[impossible]]) but running with some wild baseless assumptions like <br>
			(random pick) "the Earth will rotate the other way tomorrow" is just a clear sign of insanity.

	This "~~eveything~~ is ~~possibe~~" [[~~whisful~~ thinking]] mindset <br>		This "everything is eventually possible" [[wishful thinking]] mindset <br>
	is in stark polar contrast to ~~the~~ stringent [[exploratory engineering]] methodology. <br>		is in stark polar contrast to stringent [[exploratory engineering]] methodology. <br>
	There one picks only problems where there are aspects that are exceptionally well amenable <br>		There one picks only problems where there are aspects that are exceptionally well amenable <br>
	to analysis via well established formal methods and models. And as a product one gains:		to analysis via well established formal methods and models. And as a product one gains:
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	* many construction-site open-ends where work is identified to be needed to eventually reach the identified target. See: [[bridging the gaps]]		* many construction-site open-ends where work is identified to be needed to eventually reach the identified target. See: [[bridging the gaps]]

	== Some related philosophical ~~ponderings~~ ==		== Some related philosophical pondering ==

	To prove the absolute impossibility of something one would need a complete and consistent formalized description of everything. <br>		To prove the absolute impossibility of something one would need a complete and consistent formalized description of everything. <br>
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	that cannot yet be thought about because its completely beyond all our horizons.		that cannot yet be thought about because its completely beyond all our horizons.

	So by pulling its own rug does the incompleteness proof disproof its own validity?		So by pulling its own rug does the incompleteness proof disproof its own validity? <br>
	Or rather does it make itself into an completely information devoid statement?		Or rather does it make itself into an completely information devoid statement?
	Fundamentally unanswerabel questions I guess? <br>		Fundamentally unanswerabel questions I guess? <br>

Apm: /* Related / Impossible

2023-06-20T11:00:18Z

Related: * Impossible

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:00, 20 June 2023
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	* [[High performance of gem-gum technology]]		* [[High performance of gem-gum technology]]
	* [[For all practical purposes]] (FAPP)		* [[For all practical purposes]] (FAPP)
			* [[Impossible]]

Apm: Apm moved page Ultimate limits to Ultimate limit: plural => singular

2021-07-09T08:35:29Z

Apm moved page Ultimate limits to Ultimate limit: plural => singular

← Older revision	Revision as of 10:35, 9 July 2021
(No difference)

Apm: /* Limit to density of mass */

2021-07-08T11:28:56Z

Limit to density of mass

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:28, 8 July 2021
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	'''It is not possible and will never be possible to''' <br>		'''It is not possible and will never be possible to''' <br>
	'''go way above density of say [[osmium]] metal.''' <br>		'''go way above density of say [[osmium]] metal.''' <br>
	If something where to to have more density of mass (~~without~~ the bounds of currently known physics),		If something where to to have more density of mass (beyond the bounds of currently known physics),
	then it would need to be something very different than our known chemistry with atom of the periodic table. <br>		then it would need to be something very different than our known chemistry with atom of the periodic table. <br>

Apm: /* Limit to energy density */

2021-07-08T11:28:21Z

Limit to energy density

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:28, 8 July 2021
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	If something where to be more energy dense (beyond the bounds of currently known physics),		If something where to be more energy dense (beyond the bounds of currently known physics),
	then it would need to be something very different than our known nuclear physics. <br>		then it would need to be something very different than our known nuclear physics. <br>

			----

	Here's a paper by Robert A. Freitas Jr. on [[energy density]] in APM systems:		Here's a paper by Robert A. Freitas Jr. on [[energy density]] in APM systems:

Apm: /* Limit to energy density */

2021-07-08T11:27:57Z

Limit to energy density

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:27, 8 July 2021
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	'''It is not possible and will never be possible to'''<br>		'''It is not possible and will never be possible to'''<br>
	'''go way above the power densities of hydrogen nuclei.''' <br>		'''go way above the power densities of hydrogen nuclei.''' <br>
	If something where to be more energy ~~dense~~ dense (~~without~~ the bounds of currently known physics),		If something where to be more energy dense (beyond the bounds of currently known physics),
	then it would need to be something very different than our known nuclear physics. <br>		then it would need to be something very different than our known nuclear physics. <br>

Apm: /* Limit to energy density */

2021-07-08T11:26:25Z

Limit to energy density

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:26, 8 July 2021
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	'''It is not possible and will never be possible to'''<br>		'''It is not possible and will never be possible to'''<br>
	'''go way above the power densities of rocket fuels.''' <br>		'''go way above the power densities of rocket fuels.''' <br>
	If something chemical where to be more energy dense dense (~~without~~ the bounds of currently known physics),		If something chemical where to be more energy dense dense (beyond the bounds of currently known physics),
	then it would need to be something very different than our known chemistry with atom of the periodic table. <br>		then it would need to be something very different than our known chemistry with atom of the periodic table. <br>

Apm: /* Limit to tensile strength (and to spinning stuff fast) */

2021-07-08T11:25:14Z

Limit to tensile strength (and to spinning stuff fast)

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:25, 8 July 2021
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	'''go way above the tensile strength of diamond nanofibers and carbon nanotubes.''' <br>		'''go way above the tensile strength of diamond nanofibers and carbon nanotubes.''' <br>
	If something where to be stronger (beyond the bounds of currently known physics),		If something where to be stronger (beyond the bounds of currently known physics),
	then it would need to be something very different than our known chemistry with ~~atom~~ of the periodic table.		then it would need to be something very different than our known chemistry with atoms of the periodic table.

	A collary of the ultimate limit in tensile strength is the [[unsupported rotating ring speed limit]] which says that: <br>		A collary of the ultimate limit in tensile strength is the [[unsupported rotating ring speed limit]] which says that: <br>

Apm: /* Limit to tensile strength (and to spinning stuff fast) */

2021-07-08T11:24:51Z

Limit to tensile strength (and to spinning stuff fast)

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:24, 8 July 2021
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	'''It is not possible and will never be possible to''' <br>		'''It is not possible and will never be possible to''' <br>
	'''go way above the tensile strength of diamond nanofibers and carbon nanotubes.''' <br>		'''go way above the tensile strength of diamond nanofibers and carbon nanotubes.''' <br>
	If something where to be stronger (~~without~~ the bounds of currently known physics),		If something where to be stronger (beyond the bounds of currently known physics),
	then it would need to be something very different than our known chemistry with atom of the periodic table.		then it would need to be something very different than our known chemistry with atom of the periodic table.

Ultimate limit - Revision history

Apm: /* Wishful thinking vs Exploratory engineering */ some improvements

Apm: /* No! Nothing is absolutely impossible. Everyone wo says so is wrong. */ some reformulations and changes

Apm: /* Related */ * Impossible

Apm: Apm moved page Ultimate limits to Ultimate limit: plural => singular

Apm: /* Limit to density of mass */

Apm: /* Limit to energy density */

Apm: /* Limit to energy density */

Apm: /* Limit to energy density */

Apm: /* Limit to tensile strength (and to spinning stuff fast) */

Apm: /* Limit to tensile strength (and to spinning stuff fast) */

Apm: /* Related / Impossible